Annie: Good afternoon, this is Sunday, September 8, 1968. We are at the home of Mr. and Mrs. Morgan Harrison, in California, for a deep trance lecture by Mark Probert, telegnostic and members of The Inner Circle Teachers of Light.
Yada: Sinas and Sinahas. Ena Yada di Shi'Ite.
Harry: Good afternoon, Yada. Welcome.
Yada: (Speaks first in his language). In English, Good Day. Ha da si. Is really meaning "The King's Day" in my language. Do you like talking to spooks?
Harry: Do you know one?
Yada: Oh yes.
Louise: You already told us we are all spooks in the skin.
Yada: That is right. Sometime you will be getting skinned too. But my honorable friends. I am not a spook. I am not an astral world being. I am not a spirit. I am not a ghost.
Aud: Then somebody will say, "Well, what are you?"
Yada: I am a consciousness just like you; only, as the lady said, you have your skin on, I do not live in a skin world. I do not live in matter, but in pure energy. I am a Light; a Light descending into matter, your world, so I can communicate with you. Man does not live in the body. His consciousness operates the body. The body is a mechanical doll. Consciousness is everywhere present. The trouble with spiritualism is, it teaches man he has to be dead before he can go to the land of peace. Now, if you do not get peace here, you will not get it anywhere else. Here is where the individual takes his first conscious step back to his higher self, his creative self.
He does this by becoming aware, consciously aware of his own divine nature. I would say "of his own Godness". But the word "God" is not a very good term. It speaks of a deity and a deity always needs to be worshipped, always needs to be feared. A deity is what is created by the human mind in its earlier involvement with the matter world.
Now you have a teaching which is called Concept Therapy. Now that is saying a great deal, a great deal more than most people realize. The majority of us, coming to the world, going away from it, coming back - around and around - it takes us many lifetimes to wake up, to become self aware so that we will know what we are. Not "who". Who belongs to the personality. "Who" is an earth being; "Who" is the one that is trapped in the matter world, trapped by his own mind, his own consciousness, his own lack of awareness. All this, circumscribes our actions, very much limits us. I think most of you here are already aware of that.
Life is concepts - individual dreaming, responding to the external dream through a nervous system. Now there is surely nothing wrong in that. That is the level of consciousness which physical man dwells on. He must be aware of it, but not to the exclusion of the realization that he is far more than that.
When many people get into what - is called metaphysics, they begin to realize there is something outside of the room they were born in. Because what is going on in the room, brings so much pressure - as pain - upon the individual, that when he gets his first conscious glimpse of the world outside, he wants to rush out there right away. He wants to get away from the world of pain, but in his hurry, he stops his growth more often than increases it. It blinds him more because he doesn't give his consciousness a time to look, to examine, to test.
Most people are aware of the limitations of the senses, as to their ability to feel what is really going on in their external world. But in coming to such a realization it sometimes causes the individual to want to reach out more and more. But the act of reaching necessitates one's thinking, reasoning and really feeling life around him, not just giving it a passing glance, but to pay attention to details. When we do this, we discover that the whole vast universe is a living universe. It is conscious. What it needs, from where man is concerned, is more self awareness of the individual.
That is why education begins with a few. And then each person as they wake up and come to understand, then they begin to convert a few others. Even with your marvelous communication systems today, in teaching of life you still reach only a few. Remembering that there are some 3 billion, perhaps more, on your earth, and the greater - think of this my friends - greater majority of these are totally ignorant as to their own nature.
Your scientists give you the idea that they already know it all. No true scientist does this, but the pseudo ones are enough to give this impression that they are the last word in authority. But you know, very few of these know the nature of this physical self, to say nothing of the mental self. That is why, in the field of medicine and surgery, so little can be accomplished in bringing health to people. They do not understand the nature of the body in regard to the mind, and not even the body alone. Body chemistry is a total mystery as to how it works, to the best of your scientists. They know something, to be sure, but some things are not enough.
It is said, a little knowledge is deadly. Look how deadly it is regarding cancer. The medical men tell you to hurry to them if you feel you have cancer. Yet they couldn't do a thing for you if you did hurry to them. A person once having cancer, always has it. Even though it appears they are getting healed of what they can see of the cancer, and may live many years with it, they will eventually die with it - unless they get in what you may call an accident. But is cancer any more a dreaded ailment than anything else?
Annie: May I ask a question? Why is it that when someone has the disease you mentioned, or any other one, that even if it is staved off and the patient it has claimed is called benign, why does he always have it? What is it that has not been removed?
Yada: Cancer has a way of building up in certain centers of the body, then splitting off in minute pieces and floating around in the blood stream until they find a weaker spot in some other tissue of the body. Now, one of the reasons for cancer is that almost the whole human race, the body, the blood is poisoned by the germ called syphilis. Today you know how to stop syphilis in its rampage through the body, but when you do, you still have it because it breaks off into tiny particle. This causes a change in the electrical quantity of the electrical system, the nervous system. The whole body is an electrical body. These syphilis pieces work on cells, eating the energy they find there. It eventually causes cancer growth in the body. Do any of you sitting here wish to debate that with me?
Annie: I don't want to debate but I'd like to ask, since you say we all carry some of this syphilitic virocyt sporocyst, since we all carry this, inherited from what?
Yada: Inherited from centuries of man's sexual attraction with animals.
Annie: Is the reason that some manifest it and others don't, is it that the ones who have this are subject to this disease, and those who don't have it, have a better flow?
Yada: Yes that is right. The moment something happens in any way, to stem the normal flow of the electrical current, a disease is most certain to take place. Now, what is called faith healing - whether it is done with drugs or in any other kind of treatment - if the individual who is being treated has been living a life of negation, he will not want to give up his sickness. He is using it as a defense mechanism.
Sometimes in healing, as has happened with me and with other healers, when you start to treat the sick person they faint. They pass out, they lose consciousness, or if they do not do that, they get a feeling of sickness that is overwhelming. And so, they may come to resent the healer and say that he caused them to become sicker instead of better. But the psychology of that lies with the sick person who does not want to give up his sickness.
Now this is not done consciously; it is done very much unconsciously. To negate that kind of thinking, the healer should first have a little talk with the sick person to try to find out from them when the sickness first started with them, what they were doing at the time, what was their emotional condition when they first felt the sickness coming on. In other words, find out the mental and emotional nature of the sickness before you try to heal the physical side of it. And in Concept Therapy this is an exceedingly good thing; it causes people to reason with themselves:"Why do you think what you think?".
It doesn't matter what you think, it matters why. What brought on that kind of thinking? What made you that way? What caused you to take this or that attitude to an experience or experiences? Why? When you can know this, you can rid the person of his sickness, by helping him to rid himself of it. You are not doing it; he is doing it. You are simply a sounding board, a sounding board for the sick person.
Some years ago in your country here, you had a childlike game which you called "Knock, knock, who's there?" And that's what the healer is, a door for the sick person to knock on and to answer for himself, "Who's there?" Cancer is there, tuberculosis is there, and a thousand and one other ailments. The only reason they are not as rampant today as in the past, is that your country has become more hygienic, have paid more attention to personal cleanliness.
You think the pig is a dirty animal? If you do not leave him to get into the dirt, he is a very clean animal. Man is a dirty animal, but if he gets educated to be hygienic, to be clean, like the pig, he cannot tolerate dirty things. It was many, many years before Europe - any of the countries in Europe - knew the value of soap; where most of them had never even heard of it. Do you not wonder how they managed to get in close rapport with one another? Yes. In some of the islands in the South Pacific, the natives there, in seeing soap brought by the white men, they ate it. They didn't know it was for washing. Washing? What's that? And it was this way in Europe, while they didn't eat it, they didn't wash with it either. In Ancient Egypt, they used a kind of soap something like a soap you have today what you call pumice (Lava).
Yada: Yes, pumice soap - you use it to wash grease off your hands.
Yada: But like that. I know what it is, but I do not know your name for it. The human being, really, when he takes care of his body, carries a wonderful odor, do not need perfumes. In eating the right kinds of foods, and especially not meat, the body has a good odor. Perspiration, or what you sometimes call "sweat" is sweet smelling in a clean body, also very exciting sexually. It was long used before perfumes came. Meat eating creates a kind of brassy odor to the body surface. Here again, it is a germ, one that has its own bad odor, or good odor, if taken care of the body and the mind can be a cesspool or a place of great beauty. Many years ago there was a man looking for the fountain of youth. You know of him?
Comment: Ponce de Leon.
Yada: Right. He did not know he was walking around with It. Because of his ignorance he died. He grew old and died. Youthfulness evaded him. I can honestly say to you that if you take care of your body, eat live foods. If you eat meat, very little of it. Proper bathing, and no one should be left to bathe alone. There is nothing wrong with the human body that anyone should be ashamed of it. We need someone else to help us bathe our bodies. We are built so we cannot reach all parts of it fully, the arms do not swing around enough and not everyone is a contortionist.
Something more. The majority of people in your modern cities, they eat in a hurry. The saliva doesn't have time to mix with the food. Now you know digestion starts in the mouth and if it is not mixed with the digestive juices, called saliva, the food sits in the stomach and rots. This causes bad breath. Then you get irritations, angers, which dries out the saliva in your mouth and adds to bad breath. Does it sound I am giving an advertisement?
Harry: It sounds like you are giving good advice.
Yada: Thank you. Because you wear shoes and over cloth on the feet, what you call socks - but those things the women wear, they are not socks, huh?
Yada: Yes I know, but you call another thing, that water comes out of a hose.
Harry: Garden hose?
Yada: Yes, hose, hose. Nothing is definite. Nothing is something in itself. Everything seems to be interchangeable, even your words.
Comment: Tower of Babel?
Yada: Oh yes, of course. Take care of your feet. They are always in danger. They do so much work. Give them rest. Give them good treatment in water and they will serve you much better, for much longer. EXERCISE, you know all about that today, yes? EXERCISE - you know all about it, but how many people do it?
Harry: Very few.
Yada: That is right. I have had people say to me, "Yada, we have been listening to you for a long time, will you tell us something new?" Oh, I am always willing to do that, but I ask them what they have done with what I already told them, and they say "nothing". Do you know you can extend your consciousness in any direction, wherever you want to go? But you cannot do that if you do not take care of your body, because your body will hound your mind and chain your mind. With aches and pains and sickness, you will be chained to your body. Many people like what is called phenomena. They want to ooh and aah over it, because that's all they can do anyway. Very few ask the meaning of a materialization or of an astral projection. What do you want to do that for? Do you want to become crazy?
So you become afraid to do it. So you do not find out by experience that you do not live in your body, that you are everywhere present. All you need to do is to put more consciousness where you want it to be and you will be there. In projection, the more consciousness you give to the projected body, the more aware it will be and will stay in the astral world. The greater its orbit that it will find itself in, the more easily will it be to become body-aware again without being frightened back into the body.
To move normally is to move smoothly. Jerky motions in nature hardly ever exist, but man is given to sporadic movement so it hurts his body. Here is what I call smooth and rhythmic motion: You are doing a piece of work of some kind. You are very engrossed in it. Something or someone breaks in on your consciousness and pulls you away from what you are doing. Now many people become highly irritated when this happens, so they begin to move sporadically with broken rhythm because their emotional resentment of being disturbed causes them to do it. But if we are thinking, if we are really feeling, no one can cause us broken motion. We will move smoothly. We will turn our attention from what we are doing to whatever it is our attention is called to, and then move back to what we are doing with no broken lines. This will save the heart, the lungs, the liver, the kidneys, all the organs of the body from undue pressure.
Annie: I think what you said about interrupting motion is important in regard to children too, because parents' demands (in the parents' minds) are always more important and therefore primary. The child may be doing nothing that is observable, the game might be in his mind. So the parent says, "Go do this for me."
Aud: I can see, working with children, how the affect of this has created what is called emotional disturbance in all the children I have worked with.
Yada: Is right.
Annie: In other words, the adult rate of flowing isn't the same as children's rate, so we are always imposing on them. And then they become us, so don't we all grow up jerky?
Yada: That is a good thought.
Annie: I mean it happens to all of us.
Yada: Of course. Yes. Your whole civilization is this way. With very rare exceptions, everybody being raised this way, raised their children this way and then they wonder why ailments, sicknesses continue to harass man. In spite of their best managing, medicine, and all these things, they do not stop to think of what is going through the mind of a person and how those thoughts, if interrupted suddenly, can cause short circuiting of the energies, the electrical energies in the nervous system. You know, It is always easy for one who has no children to tell those who do have children how to raise them. But I am not saying how to raise them.
I am just telling you what happens when you do not do things intelligently, either with children or adults. That's all I am saying. You draw your own conclusions and act upon what I say, in your particular way, and that's the only way it can be done. One of your teachers sitting over here, Harry, in his teachings tries to give thought and consideration to you as individuals, and how you observe what he is saying, and how you use what he is saying. But he cannot do it for you. You must do the work for yourself. And when you fail, do not say that he is not a good teacher, but that you are not a good student, that you are not listening, that you are not paying attention so you are losing out, not him.
People often attack me for reasons that have nothing to do with me, nothing whatsoever. It is something that is going on in their minds and they think what they are thinking is what I am thinking. It is not. Last evening I was talking here in Los Angeles and there was a man there who prides himself on being an investigator in para-psychology. When he asked me where I lived, in my time, and I tell him the Himalaya Mountains and I tell him that I am six feet tall, he say, "that's impossible. Only small people can live in the mountains. There is not the proper oxygen supply to make a big person." That's strange, you know. It is strange because I am a big person whether he believes it or not. It's like the story of the bee, you know, the bumble bee. According to aero-dynamics, it cannot fly, but because the bee doesn't know this, it flies. And so it is with all nature.
The unlettered mind, as to the reality of life, cannot say what is and what is not. They tell me that a big person or a little person, that what makes them so, is something called genes and chromosomes. What has this got to do with, how much oxygen they breathe, or how little? You have a genetic set up that is a race thing. But then again, there is something called individual. And here we are very special, very different from one another, even with the genetic system trying to tell us if your grandfather has blue eyes, your father has blue eyes, the son has blue eyes, then everybody has blue eyes. But somehow it doesn't work out that way. Many people who have blue eyes, eventually give birth to someone who has brown eyes.
Black children, when they are first born, have blue eyes. But you all know they turn black or brown in time. Blue eyes is more a lack of pigment, than pigment. Same as white skin, white skin is lack of a certain chemical substance that makes the skin black or brown or yellow or whatever.
Q: Are you indicating there is a higher vibratory rate in white that causes the pigment to be left out?
Yada: I would be afraid to say it, because it would send everybody vibrating high.
Q: Is that bad?
Yada: Is it bad? You cannot vibrate any faster than you vibrate. That's logical! Ha, ha. One time Mark went to a medium where there is a materialization to take place and the medium lady said, from the cabinet, to all the people sitting in the dark room, "Everybody get your vibrations up". Well, Mark looked around to see who had their vibrations with them because he knew he didn't, so perhaps some others had left their's at home as well.
She repeated this and said, "Get your vibrations up real high. High, high, high!" When she said that, Mark immediately knew who was coming. Only one person could possibly want vibrations that high - Jesus the Christ. He is still wasting his time running around seance rooms. Would you believe it? Do you think that this great being, this great avatar, who never died on the cross for anyone but himself, would now be waltzing around seance rooms? Because that's what he did. This was a concoction of the medium. Man, in his religious beliefs, leaves him in a swamp of negativity, because he is afraid. Religions produce fear. They coerce man into being what he is not - an angel, a being of goodness and light. Nature knows nothing about goodness and light. But there is something deeper. There is a light, deeper than what the religious person has any awareness of at all. Something more real, more natural to humankind.
Does a flower bloom instantly? No, it takes time for it to extend and open its petals. Man has no desire to wait to grow, to wait to blossom. He wants to tear into it. I want it now. You want what now? If you only knew what you wanted, that would be different, but the majority of people do not know what they want.
"I'm afraid." My basic fear as a human is dying. I'm afraid to die. I'm afraid I will be shut off from the blue skies and the sun, the water and the trees and the very joy of life that is in me. If I die, all these will vanish and leave me in darkness. With this kind of thinking, there are many people who have developed a psychological fear of going to sleep because they may die. You can't die. The consciousness was not made that way, not made of that stuff. It cannot be gotten rid of. I am I, and there is no other "I" like me. You say that also, "THERE IS NO OTHER 'I' LIKE ME." You are a special thing. Sometimes it's very hard to believe that.
Sometimes life crowds us around. It tends to smother us, smother us with anxieties and quilts and shames, so we come to belittle ourselves. And then others, sensing that, tend to improve upon it by belittling us more - for the more "down" you are, the more "up" I am. That's the way many, many people think. No matter how you lose your physical body, that consciousness called "you" is never touched unless you let it be, by your ignorance, or by my ignorance, as the case may be. You want to say something to me? It's nice to hear my own voice, but I would like to hear your's too.
Q: Would you say something about a person's dreams?
Yada: Yes, yes.
Q: Would it be helpful for us to analyze them? Beneficial?
Yada: Sometimes I would say no, because some dreams are very, very frightening, like some parts of our life, our conscious life, our conscious dream, very frightening. And when we start to analyze our conscious life, something within us wants to rebel. We cry, "Oh no, I'm not like that, I wouldn't do that for that reason. You have me wrong; I wouldn't do that, not me! But now my neighbors, they're very peculiar people. Go ask them." And you will find, they will send the questioner back to you. You are strange people. Your beliefs are odd, and what is crudely put, nutty. You know "nutty'?
Q: What about higher consciousness when we come into physical being ? Is that the lower form of consciousness ?
Yada: Yes, it is an entity for here, the physical dream. Sometimes I have referred to it as the schizophrenic jackass. It doesn't know truth. But you know, it knows something that keeps us alive here in this level of consciousness, that the higher consciousness could not do for it.
Q: Does it know in advance how long it will exist in physical form?
Yada: Sometimes an individual, in passing, that personality survives the death of the body for so long as it wants to stay in that particular vibration or level of awareness, in some cases, for hundreds and thousands of years; for others just an overnight stop before they are back here again. An overnight stop.
Q: That explains why a baby is born and dies right away?
Yada: That is right. They do it right here. They come here and stay a day, perhaps two days, and then go away. When they do that, they have to come right back again because there is nothing to keep them on that side of consciousness or on this one. They have to develop it here. They have a better chance here, so they come back very, very soon. And there is nothing wrong with the physical world except as the individual, their concept of It, their concept of what is happening around them day in, day out, by the hour, by the minute.
Annie: Could you say why we have a better chance to develop it here than in the mental state?
Yada: Because in the mental state, the pure mental state, there is nothing to develop. The individual already has what he needs and he moves in that state of what he has, with no further reaching out.
Harry: In other words, he has no originating power on the other side. He just carries over with him what is impressed on him here?
Yada: That is right. Now you see, when you are going away somewhere you know what you should do, even if everybody doesn't always do it. You pack a bag. But what you have in it, depends upon where you are going. What about the weather conditions? Hot or cold? Warm or cool clothes will you put in the bag? Do you like stories that are of little value to the mind, what you call cheap novels? Then that's what you will put in your bag. But if you are a real reader of life, you will put that kind of book in your bag. But in any event, the traveler must pack a bag. It only matters to him what he puts in it.
Some people have very little to put in their bags and so they arrive with very little. And so their life is short lived in that life before they died there to come back here. It is the same looking from this side. You die here, to go there; and die there, to come back here. But the dying is simply losing a particular state of consciousness. That is all.
Louise: So are you saying it is when we have our bags packed with the necessary equipment, that's when our journey back and forth is over?
Yada: That is right. When you have an understanding of what you are, when you come to the knowledge that you are a divine being that you are the creator, then you need not come back to the physical dream. You can make what you want, where you are, wherever you are.
Annie: When you realize that you are the bag....
Yada: You don't even have to take anything with you.
Louise: Could you go further - what about humanity as a whole?
Yada: Can't even talk about it, because there is nothing whole about humanity. When you speak of masses of people, it is like speaking of units of energy in a steel encased tank - gas. You are talking about pieces running around wild. You cannot predict where any of those pieces will hit the side of the casement or will hit one another. So it is with man. Man in mass is impossible to predict about. I've heard, what appeared to be very learned people, speak that the masses of humankind, the whole world is going to be uplifted. In whose opinion? Who is going to do the uplifting? Each individual is a special unit unto himself. Would you like to be lifted up to someone else's level of consciousness? Because it may be down from yours.
Q: In your culture was the world the same as it is now with wars and politics? And the young people with their new thoughts?
Yada: Young people are always the new thoughts of the world, new ideas. They represent that the moment they are born and it is amazing to me, that parents do not see that. They are, and the parents who produced them, brought them here, they are units of consciousness for the growth of the worlds.
Comment: So what are you saying is, there nothing wrong with our young people but it is how we look at it ourselves?
Yada: That is right. How each generation looks back on its production for their children. How? Why do some parents actually create delinquents in their children, of their children? Often because they are trying to stop them from expressing themselves. A child should be taught from the time it is born, little by little, truth, how things are. The world must stop giving each generation fairy stories, lies, not even good fairy stories, but lies. Lies. Lies born out of the parents, frustration and anxieties about religion, about politics, sex, about food, about, about, about.
Parents mostly are not holding back teachings of sex for the child's sake, but for their own sake because they are ashamed, ashamed of sex because they were made ashamed by those who came before them. Same way with religion. For thousands and thousands of years, when man first discovered that he was different from the rest of the animals in the zoo, this great zoo, called the world. Man acquired a desire to find something more intelligent than himself that he could go to in his fear for consolation, for comfort, for protection. He didn't see himself that big. But you know his ingenuity, out of his imagination, always causes him to bring into being that which will prove useful to him at that time, or at any time. That's why I say, man is the Creator. The human consciousness is the Creator. I do not mean the lower consciousness for that is a created thing too, by the higher consciousness, by the dreamer, by the puppeteer. It passes down knowledge to its doll that it dangles on the strings of its emotions.
It will wake up the doll and then the doll will disappear as it must do. So that the creator or the puppeteer may stop playing games with itself; So that it may come down and be one with its creation instead of coming down in a diving suit. Come down and do the work itself - not himself - itself.
My friends, I do not have the words to tell you what great beings you are. And even if I did, if you do not have the ability to translate these words into meaningful things for yourself, it wouldn't make any difference what I said. You will forgive me, I must leave for a little while.
Harry: You will come back in a little while?
Group: Welcome back Mark!
Mark: Back in a flash, nothing to It! Thank you, Sir. Do you remember a game . . . .
- - - - - - -
Prof. Luntz: How do you do! I am Professor Alfred Luntz.
Group: Welcome, Professor!
P.L.: Thank you, Sir. It has been quite a time since I have been in your home, Sir.
Harry: Yes. Welcome again!
P.L.: Thank you very much. You have a very lovely place here.
Harry: You mean in body form?
P.L.: Yes, in body form. I was formerly, once, now an ex clergyman, for the High Episcopal Church of England. I thought when I came over here that I would take off my backward collar. But then it occurred to me it would be better if I simply turned myself around and that is exactly what I did, but not right away. I kept on being a clergy man in mind, in my mental body for five years. And in that state of consciousness, I didn't know what had happened to me because I didn't find myself in the Christian heaven that I promised myself and had promised to so many other people of my parish. And now I was simply walking around London. Perhaps that was heaven enough.
But there was one thing that made me extremely happy, I didn't find hell either. And that was wonderful, except the hell of my former belief. I couldn't imagine, I couldn't create a picture of what heaven looked like. I spent some time looking all over England for it and then all over Germany for it. That shows you how foolish we can be. Our misconceptions of what we think is true. You here are following the teachings called Concept Therapy of perhaps Positive Thinking. It will serve you well, not only here, but in whatever hereafter you may find yourself in. I have been coming through Mark more often lately because I shan't have too much time to be coming. I am going to be born again and I'm hoping to retain some memory of the things I have learned since coming here. I'm hoping to be an architect. I'm going to stay away from the clergy. I've had enough of it. (Handling Mark's silver Anhk)
ANHK. beautiful symbol, but only a symbol. What does it mean to you, or to Mark? Then that's what it is. It was something quite different to the Ancient Egyptians. They often carried these crosses into their rites and rituals of the temples. It was an assurance that man cannot die. He is continuous because he is the creator. Many people do not want to accept the thought that they are the creator. It seems to be too much and the reason it seems to be too much is because they have been taught that it is too much, that someone else did it for them, that everything they found here was here waiting for them when God made them and pushed them into this physical substance. I passed away in 1893 at the age of 81 years. I had never had a sick day in my life. I retired to my rooms a little after four, which was a little after tea time.
Harry: That figures.
P.L: I'm afraid so. So I went to my bed and the next thing I knew I was standing by the foot of my bed with my wife, my two daughters and my family physician. I think some of you have heard this story before, but for those who haven't, I like to talk about my post-mortem state. Someday you are going to have the experience of going to your own funeral. It is a wonderful experience if you do not believe that body which is in the coffin is also you. They will plant that, so that another one can come up again.
Annie: Another what?
P. L.: Body! This matter has to be used over and over again - not that there isn't already plenty of it, but you simply can't get rid of it. That's the magic of matter, you can't get rid of it, you can only push it around. There is no other-ness of life where you can lose this body. It can't be lost to the nature laws. It belongs here. Now, my colleague, Yada, has said, and I am very willing to accept what he says as being so, that he took this with him, the physical body with him. But did he take it as it was, or did he not reduce it to pure energy or to pure thought, which is what it really is, pure thought.
Harry: In other words, there is nothing in this world but thought?
P. L.: That is right, Sir.
Harry: That is why we use the term concepts.
Q: Which would be more important, thought or feeling?
P. L.: My colleague, Yada, says feeling is more important than thought. When we live in our feeling self, we have a better taste for life. In thought, we have a way of creating distasteful things. We can't get with it, as it were, by thinking about it. I doubt very much if this universe could possibly have come into being, by something that man calls thought, but rather what man calls feeling. So every thing, every individual thing, is really a concept, a symbol in the mind of the creator. I mean this and this in English we may call a cow, or this, a horse, or this, a plant of some kind, or anything else. It is all symbolic of what is going on inside; the creator's mind. If I could only have thought that way when I lived on earth, I would never have become a clergyman.
Annie: When we say we are thinking, maybe we should say, we are thing-ing.
P. L.: Quite good.
Annie: Because we are dividing things up that are already categorized instead of making our own flow.
P. L.: Duality. In the beginning all of creation came about through that sense of duality - the proton and the neutron or the electron working together, created a third condition called matter, a surface. Ideas. And each one of these things, as they are manifested, has one declaration to make and that is, "I AM" the name of the creator, "I AM". I think you will find this in your holy book as I once did, but I didn't understand it. I am duality, a tree. I am duality, an animal, a plant, an insect, a fish, a fowl, for it is all in one's mind. The Hindu realizes this and expresses his realization of it by his efforts to avoid killing anything, even things that should be killed in my opinion. Everything that is out of place is dirt, but in place, dirt isn't dirt.
Louise: Enlarge upon that a little more, Professor?
P. L.: All right my dear. If dirt belonged where you found it, you wouldn't need to clean that place to take away the dirt. Now if this dirt is outside somewhere you do not go out to clean it do you? You leave it. A dead animal, you do not leave it lying around anymore than you leave a dead human being lying around. It is dirt. It is out of place, out of time, so you put it away. Cover it up. This gives it a better chance to return to its natural source, energy. When I lived in the physical world, I thought man was something special. His specialness was the fact, that he had a soul and nothing else had a soul. Of course, I have come to learn differently. What do we mean by "soul"? The soul of the universe! The spirit of creation.
The creative consciousness feeds the matter world, makes form and comes to live in it. All kinds of form. It never asks the lower consciousness of man whether he wanted these things or not. LOCUSTS. A very, very great destructive plague to the human being. But do they come out of nothing? No more than any other insect, fish, fowl, animal or man. There is a reason and purpose. All of these things were designed to do their particular kind of work, and that's what they do. A caterpillar is a very interesting being. It does not question its existence. One moment it is a furry little animal crawling up a blade of grass, eating on it, enjoying itself as a caterpillar. And then comes a time when it becomes a cocoon, a grub. And it still doesn't question its destiny or its existence in any way, and in time becomes a butterfly. It gets great freedom that it never dreamt of before while it was a caterpillar.
Could it be possible to ask a caterpillar did it expect to become a spirit, it couldn't answer that. You could say to it, "You will become a spirit, as a spirit you will be a butterfly. You will have that much more freedom in your universe". But it wouldn't understand. Man does this. He is always questioning his existence and what is going to happen to him in the future. That's what makes the caterpillar a perfect little being. It is not concerned about what it is going to be but only what it is. And in the Light of Life and development, it becomes a cocoon. And if you cut one of these things open, all you will find in it is a little liquid. There is no sign whatsoever, there is no substance there that has the remotest resemblance to a butterfly. But there is something there in thought, in feeling of butterfly-ness. That's where it is in the cocoon and also in the caterpillar.
Harry: The reason they use this butterfly and caterpillar and little worm, is this symbolic of the stages man has to go through?
P. L.: Oh yes. Yes. You first are truly a caterpillar. You have a caterpillar consciousness, it is the lower consciousness. It has no awareness of its higher self at all. And then, little by little, as time and environment necessitate it becomes that called a cocoon. This is the first step to the higher mind, the higher consciousness, the greater reality. This is moving toward the center of our being. As a caterpillar we have found our sought after freedom. But the creator doesn't take away from the caterpillar the joy of being a caterpillar by forcing upon him the thought of what he is going to be at some future time. It's a blasted waste of time! You can't do anything about it anyway.
Q: Does a butterfly ever want to be a cocoon again, or is it ever a cocoon again?
P. L.: Yes it is. That's why it must die as a butterfly so it may return the proper substance to become a caterpillar again. Observe the fact that the cells of the body, have you ever heard of a liver cell wanting or trying to become a kidney cell? Things would get blastedly mixed up, eh what? No, but just think of that, the beauty of it. Every cell knows what it is going to become, knows what it is to be, meaning iIt knows what it is. It's a liver cell, it's a kidney cell; it's a cell at the tip of the finger here, of which there are many, many millions. The brain has billions of cells and it uses only a very few or relatively few CC's of brain substance to do all of its work, all the body work. Isn't that remarkable! This leaves the greater amount waiting to be awakened, so that in due course, man will become that which he already is. Inside there, among those vast numbers of cells, is the secret of what you and I will be in due course. How long is the butterfly's life?
Harry: Two days.
P. L.: Yes. Think of that. But two days to a butterfly is time enough to be what it is, to feel the marvelous pleasure of that butterfly nature.
Harry: It has all the consciousness it needs.
P. L.: That is right. And so do you and so do I. We are missing nothing that we need. Everything is here, waiting for the proper time, the proper environment for it to manifest. I do wish I had understood life that well when I lived in the physical world, instead of leaving everything to the Christian God.
Louise: You say you are going to be born again soon and you are going to be an architect?
P. L.: Yes.
Louise: On earth?
P.L. Yes. So I'm going to be a caterpillar again.
Louise: Why did you choose earth?
P. L.: Because that is where I got my growth. That is where I became, to some extent, self-aware. I know nothing about Mars or Venus. I have no interest there. There's nothing familiar to my feelings on those planets or any other planets in space and time as I know it. Why should I go to Mars? What has it to give me that I haven't already got? Would you go to New York if you had no reason to go there, no purpose? Just to be there? What is New York? Where is New York? Is New York one city block? Is it not made up of many conditions, many different environments? You have the slums - that's New York. So when you say you are going to New York, where? Where in New York, for New York is not one single thing, it is made up of many things, like the atom. You want to go down into an atom, but where? What body do you want to land on? What is the environment like? Have you experienced any part of the atom before, so that you have some familiar feelings to hold you there? Wouldn't you say that is true my dear?
So you see that I would have no reason for going to Venus. I couldn't care less about Venus or about Mars or about any of the other planets. That is not in my consciousness. Earth is in my consciousness and I love the earth. I never had a sick day in my 81 years. Think of that! Never a sick day, not ever so much as a headache. I do not even know the meaning of that word. I have never experienced it. You may tell me you had a headache and how severe some are and how less severe others are, but the word "severe" doesn't paint any picture for me. It doesn't convey any reality to me. Sickness, like most anything else, is a very personal experience. One who has had a headache can understand another, but who understands 10,000 headaches? Think of that.
Here in your city, the papers every once in a while tell a story of a great calamity that has happened in some other country or even some part of your own country, where perhaps a thousand or tens of thousands of humans have been wiped out (that's a good expression) from earthquakes. And what do you do? You read the article and you may or may not shake your head and say, "how sad". And then you turn to the sports page or the comics because you can't conceive of tens of thousands of people being crushed or smothered to death by an earthquake.
There is a great deal of talk today of California going Into the sea. Many people are certain of it and that it is going to happen very soon. You are all going to be wiped out. Doesn't this tell you you had better flee? Yes. But to where? Because should a disaster of such gigantic proportions take place, the east coast would be drowned. There would be no safety anywhere. The whole earth would shake. Worse than that, remembering that this earth is built in layers, one on top of the other, there is no solidity anywhere. It is very porous. And it is constantly in motion, the motion of moving in orbit besides the motion of turning around.
Now if you give this body, which is built up in layers, tremendous shocks, it could be utterly and completely blown Into dust. But, this is not going to happen at least not in your time. Some other poor unfortunates may have to face that possibility in some distant future, but you do not. California like Japan and several other places across the world, are more subject to earthquakes than other parts of the world. Nevertheless, there is hardly a place on the earth that can continue to avoid totally the possibilities of an earthquake and a very destructive one. This earth has been churned and tossed. Man has been driven from it five different times. Yet here he is on his sixth round going again, just as before. He has come back to build on a very dangerous - apparently - location, location in space. But does man concern himself really, with the dangers of his environment? No, he waits until those dangers take place.
If he has a chance, the smallest chance, when the danger is passed, he comes back and builds again on those sites. Hasn't that often happened. Whole mountains have toppled in on vast numbers of people in what is called volcanic action. When the danger seems to be over, people come again and build right on that spot. So man doesn't stop doing because he is being threatened. If that were so, crimes would stop. The threat of going to the gas chamber or the firing squad or the electric chair would keep him from killing. But it doesn't - none of these things do. When a human being says in his consciousness, "I have something I want to do", first I would try to find out a purpose for it. What will it gain me? It is always me that has to gain. What will it gain me? Now if he thinks it is going to gain him something, he is not going to stop because he is threatened by dangers.
It is like the atomic bomb. Do you think man is not going to use the atomic bomb because he is too afraid? That is foolishness. He will use it if he can find a purpose for using it. So as to excuse himself for using it. This is why we had to use the atomic bomb. This is why we had to use the first club, the first time he used a club not to hunt with - that was too tepid, no fire in it. So I would use it to hunt the hunter to I shan't have to do too much hunting. I will become a hunter expert - get all that he has hunted. It will save me from the work of hunting - I think. Something for nothing. Have you ever heard of it? I hadn't. But I thought I did when I was a clergyman. Jesus the Christ died for me. I do not have to do a damn thing about it. He already did it. Well that simply isn't the truth of it. You must do it yourself.
You must take the club of knowledge and go out and do your own hunting. It may breed disaster for someone, but then you are in a position to face disaster yourself. But can you stop doing? Of course not. As I said, I am coming back into the physical world because I want to and because I love the physical world. I was, being born of German and English parents, I was in a time which was mid Victorian. At a time it was extremely cold and indifferent to the feelings of individuals. It was a harsh age. Now I am coming to America in a time....
Q.: Where are you now?
P. L.: Where? Exactly where you are my dear. I am in consciousness. Is that difficult to grasp.
Annie: It sure is.
P. L.: Annie!
Annie: It really is. P.L. It is of course my dear, it most certainly is.
Annie: But you watched your own funeral.
P. L.: Yes. That was really jolly fun, because it was so unexpected. I didn't think I could do it. I thought the moment I died, because I was accepted, I had accepted the blood of Jesus Christ as paying for me and that I would be, the moment I died, I would be rushed off to his kingdom and be with God in His kingdom forever and ever and ever and ever.... How long is that? It is never. Never is forever, eh? Which is the longest, never or forever? That is a disturbing question, isn't it. Which is longer, never or forever and what do we mean by those words? Never, like forever, is a measure of time.
Annie: Yada was referring to packing our bags. I never asked before, but after you realized that you were not dead, did you have a different state of awareness, after you had left your physical body? What have you found in your years there, as your most valuable possession from your last earth suitcase and what do you feel will be your most valuable one coming back?
P. L.: The most valuable one, on leaving, I found to be my will to believe, to accept, to go along with things and not, to not question things, but to go along with things, to not fight life. When I first came here, I fought my thoughts, my feelings for five years, because they didn't fit with my conditioned thinking that I had acquired on earth. The pieces simply didn't fit. Where I was, and where I believed I would be, were entirely different states. And so I was hung up between the two, fighting concepts, nothing more solid than concepts and ideas, and what a battle. For five years. In my early post-mortem state, I used to visit my home and my family periodically. I should have waited a longer time than I did to do that, because the house was so often surrounded with gloom, a state of depression. A loss of father, husband, friend, spirited leader, that loss hung in the air. One would suppose that if you believe in the mercy of God, that you would send your loved ones off in freedom to go to Him; not to control them with your grief. How to get away and find myself? But it took me five years to do that.
Q.: You took your memory with you?
P. L.: Yes, but not of the earth life. It was only after I forgot earth life that I could have any peace of mind in my new state of awareness. When I realized that no being came to save me and no god threatened me into goodness or evilness, but that I had been these things myself and to myself. When I realized that, I got clear of the physical dream for quite a period of time, I rested. I relaxed. I lived in beautiful, comfortable, marvelous surroundings where there was no darkness anywhere to bring anxiety to me, no threat upon my soul, spirit, or whatever we may call that beautiful controlling being. I was free at last, not haunted by my own guilt feelings about how many others I had led astray with what I call the Christian teachings. Free. Free at last! Free heavenly state? Ah yes, the most profound, the most beautiful heavenly state. I found myself, my solar-self, the Light within. Oh yes, at peace.
And you know, until we wash out of our systems, our anxieties about our life, our guilt feelings, we move around in this other state of awareness, which is sometimes referred to as the "astral world" , In a kind of fog, not knowing whether we are dead or alive. Well, so many of us do that here, not knowing whether we are dead or alive. Sometimes when I become aware of Mark - well he has a beard now. When I become aware of his body, I can feel his hurts. What a rough thing it must be for him. Especially do I feel these because I had not known such things when I lived In the physical body. So now I am more acutely aware of being in a body when it hurts.
Comment: Yet Mark was responsible for his own life.
P. L.: Quite so, my dear, quite so. And he must do, or at least bear up under them to the best of his ability. For he, like you, like everyone, has a work to do, and if he doesn't accomplish it in this life, he'll have to come back and try it again. This is a kind of Karmic thing. I do not like to say that, for so is everything, right?
Comment: Yes it is.
P. L.: That is right. And we can get ourselves tied up in such thoughts that produce very, very false concepts about what is really happening to us. You know, not too long ago, I had a gentleman say that I am losing my English accent. Do you find it that way?
Harry: To a certain degree, yes.
Comment: I should hope so, if you have been in school, learning to be an American.
P.L.: Exactly so. I am practicing to be an American, and what they do with the English language is an abomination! I sometimes like to say my real reason to come back, and wanting to come back to America, is so that I can say "ant" instead of "aunt" or "lauff" Instead of "laugh". It is "laugh" you know. LAUGH is "LOFF" - It is not "laff". And speaking of insects, how's your ant? Not bad for me, eh?
Harry: You're learning.
P. L.: Yes indeed I am. I will enjoy my life when I get here. I know what joy is, so I can appreciate it. So I shan't do anything to hurt myself, I hope! Who knows about tomorrow? Who knows? When there is no tomorrow. This is the hour of my being. This is the hour of my life. There is no other time! Live it - Feel it - Be it. You know when you get dead, your chances of learning what you should have learned are gone. You have to wait to get alive in the physical world again. This is a special classroom in which the individual learns to become conscious and aware - self aware. Well, I shan't hold you any longer.
Harry: Has Arakashi been around lately?
P. L.: No, most of the Asiatics are still very much at work with their individual countries, trying to get groups together on earth to create a sound of peace. Peace. Be still, and the storm subsided, vanished. Peace. Be still, for I am with you - I, peace. I am with you. Well, ta ta.
Harry: Is Yada coming back for a few minutes?
P. L.: I do not know. I will have to leave it to him. But if you desire him, I am certain he will be happy to do that.
Aud: I have a question about the Zodiacal signs. Can you answer It?
P. L.: No
Aud: We thank you very much.
Annie: I would like to tell you something I got a kick out of. It is one of your American seedlings that has taken root if you look back at the place where you were practicing that you'll see what I mean. It is something you said is new for you and it is a phrase, and the way you said it: It is, "I am coming here" comma "Because I want to"'.
P. L.: That shows I am learning. I am losing the Englishman. We can't be two things at one time, and do right to both things. So I'll be here, not too distant from now. But you know it is going to be years. I must leave here shortly, within at least the next year, or two years at the most, where I can't come anymore. It will take me, by earth years, earth time, approximately 15 years to lose, to lose Luntz, to lose Alfred. I have long lost "Professor", unless you call me that. I certainly do not use it in the world I am in. Who would care?
Louise: They showed you that one time, didn't they?
P. L.: Yes, exactly.
Group: We sure appreciate your coming here and enlightening us.
P. L.: Thank you, Sir. Well, it is your work to do that also, to your students, and we, are both in the same work. I hope yours pays off as much as mine is going to.
Group: Thank you very much. PAUSE. Breathing audible (heavy breathing for a few minutes.
Annie: Is someone trying to come in and say hello to us?
Harry: Yada will be here in a minute.
= = = = = = =
Irene: Harry? Annie?
Annie: You just had a trip, didn't you?
Irene: Yes I did and I was listening to Alfred Luntz, and I am sad to say, he is going to leave my world. He is going to go back to the physical world and I do not know how he can do that.
Group: Maybe when you get a little older you will.
Irene: Perhaps. Maybe that's it. How are you my dear?
Annie: Just wonderful, dear, and we'd like to know how you are!
Irene: I know of no time when I have been so well. Harry?
Harry: Yes, Irene.
Irene: We know one another, don't we?
Harry: Yes we do. Welcome to our home again. I thought you might come today. How about that!
Irene: You are both looking so very well. And some, or do most of the rest of you remember me?
Group: Yes, Irene. I remember. We were all at your house.
Irene: It is just no time ago. I do miss earth life. I didn't want to die, I felt I had too much to do. I couldn't waste my time being dead. So many things I wanted to continue in the work with Mark. But then, my body would not permit that. So, rather than continue to suffer in it, I left it. There are some things that I did not have control over. As some of you remember, I had a very dominant nature. I could control some things, but that got out of hand. Oh, I visit Mark once in a while, but most of time he is not aware that I am in the house with him.
Annie: I felt you, coming over here.
Irene: Yes you did, Annie. You have proven such a great help to the work and to Mark. I am so appreciative of your kindness to Mark and to the work and giving so much attention to it, and growing up in it yourself, like I did.
Annie: Well it just gives me the feeling that I am doing so little and I need to do so much more.
Irene: My dear, I had exactly the same feeling about it.
Annie: How do you like Mark's beard?
Irene: Well he had one quite a few years ago when his hair was darker and he didn't have to dye it. He tried that you know, and - oh my - the dye burned his skin.
Annie: Well we have convinced him now, that to have wisdom he'll have to have grey hair, so he won't be dying it again.
Irene: You see, that doesn't go for the female. In fact, the female is not supposed to have wisdom. I learned so very much from all the members of the Circle. I am now one of them.
Irene: Thank you. I came in on the tail end of things.
Group: There was always that one little spot open, waiting for you.
Irene: Yes, I often wondered who that last one would be .... I knew it was a woman, but I didn't know it was going to be me! What an honor. What a wonderful thing! I sit in groups like I did when I was living here.
Annie: We want you to practice coming a lot because we know you are the closest earth tie we had and some of us were contemporaries and I think that's a very important learning tool.
Irene: You know, when I - a few days ago - I tried to get through to Mark and I hoped he would bring his writing tablet with him. I had some things I wanted to tell him of the world I am in here. And since I have been here, these last six or seven months now, I've learned things are different than when I first came. There is a better atmosphere around me. Well, I wanted to tell Mark.
Annie: Well he forgot his book, but I brought It. So it is in the car if you need it.
Irene: Thank you dear, I'm getting tired.
Group: We appreciate that you could come at all.
Irene: Yes, and my love to all of you.
Harry: Take ours with you. Is Yada coming through.
Irene: I do not know. I have never seen him. Only Alfred Luntz. Perhaps I will see the others in time. But you know, everything is so warm and nice, so warm and beautiful. Well, bye bye.
Annie: Ciao. (An Italian expression of greeting or parting.) Pronounced "chow").
Harry: It is time to eat, Irene. Chow time.
Mark: Let's eat...